|
|
The 2005 Martin Joseph Interview by James Horrox
Website
| Album Reviews
Back
to interviews.
June 8th 2005
Many people have tried to attach a label to Martyn Joseph; the perennially charismatic Welshman has been described as many things over the years - singer/songwriter, folk-troubadour, raconteur, God-botherer, activist, balladeer, Celtic rocker, protest-singer….the list, as they say, goes on.
Whatever else Martyn Joseph is (and it is clear that ‘singer/songwriter’ doesn’t even begin to cover it), he is a man on a mission. Renowned for his slamming indictments of government oppression and social injustice and his stark, evocative narratives of episodes of social history, his songs are suffused with the kind of power, anger and political protest seldom if ever seen in the contemporary musical climate.
It is June 2005 when I finally get to interview Martyn, and while Bob Geldof is busy organising Live 8 and encouraging us to march on Edinburgh in protest at developed nations’ continuing inertia over African debt and world poverty, the most powerful suits on the planet are preparing for the G8 summit at Gleneagles, Scotland. It goes without saying that the issues of inequality and social justice which will form the backbone of the summit are ones which have always been close to Martyn Joseph’s heart; indeed, over a career spanning the best part of two decades his reputation as a political activist and trade justice campaigner has often virtually eclipsed that of his manifold musical accomplishments.
For those unfamiliar with Martyn’s work, this is a man who has campaigned tirelessly throughout his career to promote various charities and political pressure groups, often specifically drawing attention to less well-known causes such as Brazil’s MST (Movmento dos Sem Torra). Martyn has recently become a patron of the charity Advantage Africa, and in May 2003 he released a 5 track EP “The Great American Novel”, collaborating with his former Faith, Folk and Anarchy partners Tom Robinson and Steve Knightley, from which all proceeds are going to the charity War Child set up in the wake of the 2003 invasion of Iraq. Heavily involved with countless other good causes including Amnesty International, Christian Aid, Casa Alianza, Aids charity The Stephen Lewis Foundation and Jubilee 2000, Martyn has become something of a figurehead for the global fight for trade justice, third world debt cancellation and human rights.
From the moment I bring up the subject of the G8, Martyn talks enthusiastically about this year’s summit as “a pivotal moment in history, a real chance to do something great, to ensure that in years to come, our children’s children don’t look back at 2005 and simply see yet another opportunity squandered”.
“There’s a line in one of my songs”, he says, looking away coyly as if almost embarrassed to be talking about his own music in the context of such globally monumental issues, “‘history will slaughter us…’ – I think that sums it up for me. It actually comes from something John Pilger says in his book The New Rulers of The World; there’s a chapter where he’s talking about the misery suffered by Iraqi citizens as a result of U.N. sanctions in Iraq after the first Gulf war and he says something along he lines of ‘history will slaughter those responsible’. It’s true - you know, we look back at certain things that have happened throughout history, things that happened maybe four, five hundred years ago or even more recently and say ‘how was that ever allowed to happen? What must people have been thinking?’ Well unless we make the most of this opportunity, people will be saying that about us in the future. History will slaughter us”.
Within minutes of meeting Martyn it is obvious that this is a man who is as engaging in conversation as he is on stage; with a smile permanently etched into his handsome features and a sparkle in his eye he speaks at length with energy and conviction, anxious to take advantage of any platform from which to get his message heard.
Indeed, while government rhetoric and economic policy towards developing nations have been met with a good deal of cynicism recently from press and public alike, it is somewhat refreshing, if perhaps a little surprising, to find that Martyn remains remarkably sanguine. Displaying an almost child-like optimism and irrepressible faith in human nature he is resolute in his conviction that although Blair may be “a liar” (“but then again, aren’t we all?” he muses), the PM and chancellor Gordon Brown are “fundamentally decent human beings” with genuinely estimable motives at heart.
“I bet, in his private moments alone, you know, on the toilet in the morning or whatever,” he grins at the idea, “I bet, deep down, Tony Blair the person regrets what he did in Iraq”.
Artists of all denominations have a tendency to polemicise, frequently displaying a predilection for ill-informed ranting founded on half baked pop-politics and received wisdom, cautious not to stray from the parameters laid out by whatever viewpoint happens to be en vogue at the time. Indeed while many in the music establishment have been quick to board the anti-Blair and anti-Bush bandwagons Martyn talks lucidly and cogently about politics and current affairs, offering an informed, intelligent and even-handed perspective, and one which perhaps reflects the deep rooted Christian faith which underpins his work.
It is no secret that Martyn shares much of the anti-war sentiment which led to such a disappointing result for Labour in May’s general election, but he none the less remains optimistic that as this year’s president of the G8 Blair will do his level best at Gleneagles, even suggesting that the PM may be able to win over Washington’s neoconservative cabal by means of “appealing to their compassionate side”. (I briefly wondered at this point if he might be joking). “I’m sure even George Bush has a compassionate side,” he laughs. “We’ll see.”
This positive, and indeed slightly offhand attitude to the American leadership, I have to say, struck me as somewhat strange, especially considering the battering Martyn gives the neo-con establishment in some of his songs (How Did We End up Here? leaps to mind); Martyn obviously notes my puzzled expression, and elaborates; “If you talk about things in terms of money or material aid then the Americans get very cagey – but if you talk about it in terms of ideas, for example ‘we’re going to lift so many children out of poverty’ or, ‘we’re going to bring freedom to these people’, or whatever, then they’re much more prepared to get behind you, and I think that’s where Tony Blair’s strength lies.”
Maybe he has a point. As to where he himself fits into this, Martyn as ever remains eminently down to earth. “I’m not a Bob Geldof or a Bono”, he says, “I’m just not that famous! I can’t get an audience with the prime minister like they can. I wish I could,” he says, “but that’s just the way it is”.
And it’s true that in spite of having released 15 albums to date and sold bucket-loads of records worldwide, not to mention having shared a stage with likes of Suzanne Vega, Marc Cohn, Joan Armatrading, Clannad, Celine Dion, Jools Holland, Art Garfunkel, and, er…Chris De Burgh, Martyn Joseph remains undeservedly obscure.
As such, he describes himself as a “plodder”, and ‘plod’ he certainly does, working relentlessly to raise funds and awareness for the many causes he represents. “If we sell 200 white wristbands at a gig,” he points out, referring to the Make Poverty History campaign which he has tirelessly promoted over recent months, “well that’s 200 more people aware of the cause”.
And, for the record, you can multiply that figure by at least 200, as Martyn is a man who clearly finds it hard to stay off the road, thinking nothing of playing upwards of 200 shows in a year including some of the world’s largest alternative music festivals. So even though he recognises that he may not be able to reach out to the kind of audience that Bono and Geldof can, Martyn’s modus operandi is not without its logic; “I’m immensely fortunate” he says, “that I do have an audience; I’ve been given a platform to put this message across and its up to me to make the most of it.”
And make the most of it he does, his constant touring enabling him to push his message home night after night at sold-out shows all over the globe.
When I first emailed Martyn to ask if he might spare a few minutes for an interview, it was, first and foremost his political side that I wanted to talk about. The G8 and Britain’s presidency of the EU looked like being groundbreaking political opportunities about which Martyn, being a notoriously political animal, would no doubt have some interesting views. But looking back over his remarkable CV of charity work and political activism it is sometimes easy to lose sight of the fact that he is, first and foremost, a gifted musician of awe-inspiring genius.
As an acoustic artist “of almost hypnotic ability”, frequently compared to the likes of Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen and Woodie Guthrie, Martyn has been described as “one of the foremost singer/songwriters of his generation” whose work, in the words of Q magazine, conveys “a depth, resonance and emotional punch which belies comparisons”.
But then, is he first and foremost a musician or an activist? It is no doubt a question Martyn has been asked a million times; “that’s the damn problem,” he replies with a smile, “I still don’t know - I can’t decide….I guess it’s all part and parcel of the same thing for me so that’s a difficult question to answer”. Although after pondering for a while Martyn decides that his path in life is primarily that of a musician, he insists that he has “never been an ‘entertainer’”.
In a way, this self-appraisal makes a lot of sense. Any one of Martyn Joseph’s albums or live performances subjects its audience to a magnificent and beautifully-crafted emotional landslide of intense and often dark introspection, tenderness, lyrical virtuosity and unbridled anger, their subject matter centring around some of the less entertaining facets of human existence: the horrors of war, political oppression, injustice and inhumanity, a man unjustly hanged, a single mother forced into prostitution in order to feed her children….None of this is particularly cheerful stuff.
Martyn will readily admit that his music is “hardly a barrel of laughs”, but, he explains, that is the purpose of art. “Art is there to express things that we can’t explain, the beauty of a sunrise, the indescribable emotions that you feel when you’re holding your newborn child….” He tails off, “art does it for us”.
Talking to Martyn today, one thing that is eminently apparent is his heartfelt and ardent abhorrence for music and art being used and abused simply to make money “I write songs to try and make a difference. If you’re not saying something in a song”, he insists, “there’s no point writing it. The one thing I really can’t stand is art being exploited for purely commercial purposes, just to make money; it’s far too precious for that”. His disdain for the synthetic pop acts which saturate 21st century music charts is plainly obvious, a sentiment which he communicates, none to subtly, in songs like “Celebrity”
Martyn himself has had his share of major label success. After signing to Sony in 1991 he enjoyed a string of top 40 hits in the UK throughout the early 1990s, most notably Dolphins Make Me Cry, Working Mother and Lets Talk About it In the Morning which peppered the top end of the charts in 1992. Martyn parted company with Sony in 1995 and after a spell with Grapevine founded his own label, Pipe Records, in 1999.
Although he admits he occasionally “hankers after the fuss and attention” which he enjoyed during his time on Sony, not to mention the exposure afforded to him (“Sony just had to click their fingers,” he says, “and I’d be on TV or on the radio”), Martyn is where he wants to be.
“With Pipe-Records I can put out a record whenever I like – or I can put out six in one day if I feel like it. Not that I’m ever going to, but you know what I mean, I like the freedom afforded to me by being independent.” One does get the distinct impression that this man has his own, unwavering agenda, and it is difficult to imagine him kowtowing to the manifold silliness of record company bureaucracy and the unremitting corporatism of the mainstream music industry. “At the end of the day,” Martyn remarks, somewhat un-necessarily, I am just fuelled by an enormous appetite for what I do”
Over his career, Martyn has channelled this appetite into any number of worthy causes, working hard to put across his ideas through the medium of some of the most beautiful acoustic songs ever written, songs like Dic Penderyn, an epic masterpiece of a song which beautifully brings together poignancy, political disaffection and steadfast defiance in the face of injustice.
Indeed, there are two lines in Dic Penderyn which, I think, aptly summarise all that Martyn said to me today, illustrating the core beliefs that underlie this man’s unyielding drive and optimism; “louder and longer than the sound of guns” he sings “is the memory of what was done. You can only trample people down for so long my friend, and time will show you simply have not won”.
As with so much of Martyn’s music, Dic Penderyn is a haunting battle cry for the oppressed everywhere, an anthem infused with single-minded determination, hope and unwavering belief that one day the injustice and tyranny which have characterised human existence for so many centuries will be finally brought to an end.
On a lighter note, Martyn remembers with a smile, “when Rhodri Morgan was campaigning to become Prime Minister of Wales I played Dic Penderyn while standing next to him on the exact spot where Richard Penderyn was hanged.” He looks bemused for a second “it’s strange, now he is Prime Minister of Wales he won’t return my calls”. He laughs quietly to himself and shakes his head, adding “I ran into him in Tescos the other day…cornered him by the yoghurts…..”
While Martyn may not see himself as an entertainer, his live set is entertaining, his intelligent and self-deprecating humour and set against the often dark and introspective content of his music resulting in what can only be described as a near-perfect synthesis.
And it is this synthesis, I think, which makes Martyn Joseph the mesmerising musician and performer that he is. His unremitting belief in the strength of the human spirit against adversity serves as an invaluable reminder of the bigger picture, the greater good, and offers a speck of light in the darkness of these otherwise troubled times.
For more information see: www.martynjoseph.co.uk - www.makepovertyhistory.com - www.piperecords.co.uk
| |
